<sgp_> 0. Introduction <sgp_> We would like to welcome everyone to this Monero Community Workgroup Meeting! <sgp_> Link to agenda on GitHub: https://github.com/monero-project/meta/issues/471 <sgp_> Monero Community meetings are a discussion place for anything going on in the Monero Community, including other Monero workgroups. We use meetings to encourage the community to share ideas and provide support. <sgp_> 1. Greetings <ErCiccione> Hi folks <msvb-mob> Hello. <kinghat[m]> o/ <binaryFate> hello! <sgp_> ping needbrrrrrrr90 sarang <sarang> Hi <deedledea> Hi! <sgp_> hello everyone :) <sgp_> 2. Community highlights <sgp_> See Monero weekly highlights at https://revuo-monero.com <sgp_> Check out resources at https://communityworkgroup.org. It also has a calendar you can subscribe to for meeting reminders. <sgp_> We now have a Twitter! https://twitter.com/xmrcommunity <sgp_> If we have time during open ideas time, please comment on what you want to use it for. <sgp_> Diego spoke about Monero at the Messari’s Mainnet 2020 conference. Hopefully they eventually distribute a recording. <sgp_> Does anyone have community (non-workgroup) updates to share? <sgp_> 3. CCS updates <sgp_> Funding required: <sgp_> Norwegian translation of webplate, footers, nav. Menu (1.16 / 6 XMR) https://ccs.getmonero.org/proposals/Norwegian_translation_core.html <sgp_> Research post-quantum strategies for Monero (550.06 / 576 XMR) https://ccs.getmonero.org/proposals/research-post-quantum-monero.html <sgp_> Ideas (to be discussed): <sgp_> Swedish cli wallet (3 XMR) https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/147 <sgp_> dEBRUYNE and ErCiccione[m] commented on Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/gtjd6g/ccs_proposal_lets_add_support_for_swedish_in_to/ <monerobux> [REDDIT] [CCS Proposal] Lets add support for swedish in to monero cli wallet (self.Monero) | 21 points (82.0%) | 5 comments | Posted by writesofrust | Created at 2020-05-30 - 18:43:13 <sgp_> no comments on this one? <binaryFate> I don't see much value either, but don't see a reason not to pass it on to funding required <binaryFate> donors can decide <binaryFate> 3 XMR is very small, maybe it is a good test run of the CCS system by that person if nothing else <sgp_> is the gui and website already translated? <ErCiccione> Not a big fan of that proposal. We don't even know about past experiences as translator and the proposal itself seems quite lazily written <ErCiccione> let me check that <sgp_> if they have no past contributions, I think that's a reason to not advance <ErCiccione> We don't have the website in swedish. We have the GUI, which is almost fully translated <ErCiccione> i'm fine with people not having past experience with monero if they show some credentials <sgp_> did they show any? <ErCiccione> To my knowledge, no. <ErCiccione> but we didn't ask either <sgp_> I guess the proposal is on hold then until that is resolved <sgp_> final comments on this one? <sgp_> second one: <sgp_> Sarang: research funding for 2020 Q3 (492 XMR) https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/148 <sarang> I'll revisit the amount prior to opening (if this is decided) <sgp_> I highly doubt anyone will comment against this one <binaryFate> go go go!!! <sgp_> indeed <sarang> Happy to take questions here or as CCS comments <ErCiccione> I already left a thumb up on the MR <sgp_> 7 thumbs up now <sgp_> I think we can proceed since this obviously has universal support <sarang> I'll check on the amount first <sgp_> of course <sarang> So please don't merge just yet <binaryFate> sarang did you discuss with luigi1111 about the proposed "stable USD amount" buffer? <sarang> It was briefly mentioned, but not really in any more detail <binaryFate> Let's discuss and finalize decision before you adapt amount <sarang> ok <binaryFate> (decision might be not to use it, no pressure!) <sgp_> CLSAG Audit with Teserakt and OSTIF (179 XMR) https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/150 <sgp_> Teserakt has already done half of the audit on their own decision <monerobux> Test failed <binaryFate> lol <sgp_> no comments? <niocbrrrrrr> !donate [undisclosed_amount] <niocbrrrrrr> please and thank you <sgp_> haha nice <sgp_> Any other CCS comments before we move on? <sgp_> 4. Workgroup report <sgp_> is selsta here? <selsta> yes <sgp_> sweet <sgp_> a. Daemon/CLI/GUI workgroup <sgp_> go ahead :) <selsta> Will have to think :P <selsta> v0.16 was a smooth release and with no major problems. <selsta> I think we can soon prepare v0.17 with CLSAG <sgp_> selsta: do you have an ideal release date for 0.17? since it will require a hardfork <ErCiccione> Good job btw. People are super happy with the new GUI and CLI <selsta> Not yet. <selsta> I want to release at least 1 month before the hardfork time. <kinghat[m]> ya the gui is sexy af <sgp_> do you want it to happen before this fall? <selsta> I would guess hardfork 2 months after the audit is done but that might be too optimistic. <sarang> There will need to be Trezor/Ledger support in place from those teams <sarang> and they'll probably want a testnet to try it out on <selsta> We have to give exchanges and other wallets enough time to update. <dEBRUYNE> Bear in mind that CLSAG also requires changes from wallet providers <dEBRUYNE> Thus, we have to allow for more time arguably <selsta> yep <selsta> We are also thinking about signing the windows and macOS release but that might be a better topic for the dev meeting <selsta> code certificate signing* <ErCiccione> yeah. The problem with the antiviruses needs to be at list mitigated somehow. Really bad UX <selsta> might no not possible to mitigate, but we will see <kinghat[m]> did one of those hw wallets monero integration get promoted to "full" or "proper" vs just being a side thing? <selsta> you mean ledger? <kinghat[m]> im not sure 🤔 <sarang> Ledger <sarang> I'm in contact with the person now in charge of that <selsta> I did not read from the announcement that they will work on Ledger Live. <sarang> I do not know any details on that <selsta> anyway I’m done with the workgroup update <sgp_> thanks selsta! <selsta> oh and one more thing <selsta> google might add monero to their open source fuzzer: https://github.com/google/oss-fuzz/pull/3941 <sarang> IIRC moneromooo has been updating the fuzz tests in the codebase <sgp_> sweet <selsta> this will help at find bugs in the monero codebase <selsta> finding* <selsta> ok done now <sgp_> thanks! <sgp_> b. Localization workgroup <sgp_> ErCiccione any update? <ErCiccione> Not much. About 50 people contributed to translate the GUI release <kinghat[m]> this is what i read: https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/gwkmcn/ledger_monero_app_new_lead_dev/ <kinghat[m]> > Why? Until now Monero was still maintained as R&D project by myself. It is now moving in the coin integration team and will reach a new state level. That's as a good news. <monerobux> [REDDIT] Ledger Monero App: New lead dev! (self.Monero) | 149 points (100.0%) | 38 comments | Posted by cslashm | Created at 2020-06-04 - 16:21:05 <ErCiccione> It's a good number, the highest amount of translators for a release was 60 IIRC, but don't quote me on that <sarang> kinghat[m]: I've been recently put in touch with the dev who's now in charge of that <sarang> I've reached out to get information on their required/desired timeline for a network upgrade <sarang> waiting to hear back <ErCiccione> also, Weblate is starting to catch up. People are using it every day and we have about 150 people on the platform <ErCiccione> the activity: https://translate.getmonero.org/#activity <ErCiccione> beside that, not much to report <kinghat[m]> sorry for the interruption ErCiccione. <ErCiccione> no problem :) <sgp_> glad to hear so many people helped with 0.16 <sgp_> c. Outreach workgroup <sgp_> Monero Outreach recently shared their “We Accept Monero” campaign: https://www.monerooutreach.org/we-accept-monero.html <sgp_> d. Website workgroup <sgp_> lots of cool changes here :) <ErCiccione> Yeah there is a lot of stuff in progress <ErCiccione> I posted this on reddit today: https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/gxnqmf/lets_improve_the_monero_faq_page_on_getmonero/ <monerobux> [REDDIT] Let's improve the Monero FAQ page on GetMonero. What questions/answers should we add? (self.Monero) | 35 points (95.0%) | 7 comments | Posted by ErCiccione | Created at 2020-06-06 - 09:17:52 <ErCiccione> I think we should improve the FAQ adding as many qestions as possible <ErCiccione> if anybody has ideas, please post them on reddit or open an issue <sgp_> SE is definitely a good place to start <ErCiccione> or write here if you want but there is a higher chance of me forgetting it :P <ErCiccione> sgp_ i used it when i remade the faq, but now i wanted to add questions that people are asking now <selsta> I don’t think trying to replace SE with the website FAQ makes sense. (Not sure if that’s the intention) <ErCiccione> I don't intend to replace SE at all. I just think that the website should be more a point of reference. Because people are more likely to look for answers there <sgp_> not replacing SE <selsta> A lot of people google their question and get redirected to SE / Reddit. I doubt that many people will read to a huge FAQ but maybe that’s just my opinion. <selsta> through* <sgp_> this is mostly for media/journalists imo <midipoet> what's the story with #monero-defcon <sgp_> better for them to reference the site than SE <selsta> But a FAQ makes sense in general, yes. <dEBRUYNE> SE has quite good SEO fwiw <dEBRUYNE> They will often appear on top for a search <msvb-mob> midipoet: What do you mean what's the story with #monero-defcon? <sgp_> SE is good if someone googles a specific question <sgp_> FAQ is good if someone goes digging <msvb-mob> midipoet: I see now, let me try to fix that. <selsta> IMO FAQ is more for general questions about Monero, not too technical things. <sgp_> yeah agreed <ErCiccione> selsta: yep, that's my point <midipoet> msvb-mob: thankyou! <kayront> question, there was some talk months ago about ring sizes increasing to epic quantities, is that still on the table? <kayront> (hi everyone!) <sgp_> kayront: not with clsags <sgp_> longer term <ErCiccione> For who is not aware of that. I'm changing the homepage, you are welcome to review and participate to the dicussion: https://github.com/monero-project/monero-site/pull/948 <ErCiccione> oh almost forgot <ErCiccione> We are working on implementing the netlify previews on getmonero <kayront> sgp_: years? <ErCiccione> Basically every time somebody open a PR, netlify will build it and show a preview. That's useful because people without a building environment can see how a PR will look like once merged <ErCiccione> see https://github.com/monero-project/monero-site/pull/1016 <ErCiccione> That's something i look forward to and i hope will help increasing the activity on the monero-site repo <dEBRUYNE> kayront: Realistically I think Triptych is 1-1.5 years out <sarang> There are still some questions on multisig support due to some different math <msvb-lab> midipoet: You (and all of us) can now again access #monero-defcon. <midipoet> msvb-lab: thank you :-). <selsta> ErCiccione: useful :D <ErCiccione> i made a test PR that people can use as example <ErCiccione>https://github.com/erciccione/monero-site/pull/17 <midipoet> msvb-lab: there might still be a permissions issue...as I get an error trying to post a message <binaryFate> ErCiccione I'll get to the netlify thing tomorrow <ErCiccione> I PRd the edited homepage. You can see netlify's comment with a link <ErCiccione> that's the PR built and deployed <ErCiccione> thanks binaryfate :) <sarang> ErCiccione: any practical risk of an attacker fooling someone into thinking it's the real site? <sarang> I suppose such an attacker could just deploy their own clone of the code, and the domain is netlify... <kayront> asked this in -dev several mins ago before realizing there's a meeting going on, does anyone know if this would be possible: " another thing: would it technically be possible to have an "account viewkey", rather than a wallet-wide one? use cases would be services that require the viewkey to confirm payments, generate addresses etc, this is a fairly common use case; and for simplicity/backup/sanity reasons it's helpful to only have one <kayront> underlying seed" <ErCiccione> unlikely IMO <ErCiccione> but even if they do think it's the real website, there are no downloads <ErCiccione> and the links are hard to mistake. The homepage for example is built here: https://deploy-preview-17--frosty-jones-8df25a.netlify.app <sgp_> thanks ErCiccione <sgp_> anything else on the website? <sgp_> sarang: can you quickly give an update on MRL? <ErCiccione> don't think so <sarang> Sure <sarang> The CLSAG audit process is proceeding nicely
* midipoet realises there was a meeting <sarang> I spent quite a bit of time re-running and correcting some tracing analysis that came out in a preprint <sarang> The results are much better than the preprint had suggested <sgp_> that was just a class project afaict <sarang> Yes, but it got some attention and was a good excuse to run updated analysis anyway <sgp_> thanks sarang <sgp_> there's one topic ErCiccione wanted to discuss at the meeting <sgp_> ErCiccione asked to reserve some time to make a decision of using “reasonably” in the homepage: https://github.com/monero-project/meta/issues/471#issuecomment-639582413 <sgp_>https://github.com/monero-project/monero-site/issues/971 <ErCiccione> yeah let's get done with that <sgp_> I think it should be removed <sgp_> it doesn't convey the nuances it attempted to convey imo <ErCiccione> I liked it, but i see why people prefer to have it removed. If it's controversial, let's just remove it <ErCiccione> people wanted to change "slogan" anyway, no? <sgp_> yeah there were other ideas too <kayront> fwiw i think it reads a bit like a cop-out <deedledea> +1 for removing it <kayront> i understand the idea behind it, but for the uninitiated it probably reads more like "it's probably not gonna keep my stuff private" <sarang> The idea was that privacy and security always depend on risk and threat models <sgp_> who gets that from "reasonably" though if they don't already get that <sarang> understood <binaryFate> remove it please, it's only in geek circles that people might get the honest meaning. We're very honest if people dig more, no need to confuse on the homepage <kayront> yeah sarang, iirc QubesOS used/uses "reasonably secure" as well, in reality that's what it is because nothing can be 100% safe <kayront> but for new people the nuance will be lost i reckon <sgp_> any final comments? <sarang> I'm not tied to that specific wording. As long as the presentation is honest and reasonable <sgp_> okay, we can wrap up then. thanks for your patience as we went over <sgp_> 6. Confirm next meeting date/time <sgp_> The next community meeting will be in 2 weeks on 20 June at 17:00 UTC. <sgp_> The next Coffee Chat is on Saturday 27 June at 17:00 UTC <sgp_> Conclusion <ErCiccione> alright, i'll remove it tomorrow <sgp_> That’s all! Thanks for attending this Monero Community meeting, and we hope to see you on r/MoneroCommunity and #monero-community. Take care, STAY SAFE AND ISOLATED, and know that change starts with YOU.