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Logs from tini2p meeting of 2019-04-11
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layout: post
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title: Overview and Logs for the tini2p Dev Meeting Held on 2019-04-11
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summary: Current project status, Roadmap, Meta issues, and miscellaneous
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tags: [dev diaries, i2p, crypto]
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author: el00ruobuob / oneiric
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---
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# Logs
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**tini2p** hi all, meeting in ~10 min.
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**tini2p** Meeting agenda:
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Greetings
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Proposals + status updates
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Short-term goals
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Meta issues
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Confirm next meeting time
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**kinghat** hola
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**tini2p** bueno @k1nghat
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Greetings
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looks taken care of ;)
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Proposals + status updates
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agh, effin markdown
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**tini2p** Ecies updates
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zzz has made another round of updates to Proposal 144 (ECIES-X25519-AEAD-Ratchet), including:
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KDF 1, 2 & 3 for new session message
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More fleshed out handshake protocol
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Elligator2 for point obfuscation in new session message part 1
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LeaseSet2 basic implementation tini2p/tini2p!4.
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For full implementation, need to implement a blinding signature scheme
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Which scheme to implement:
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Red25519 (Ed25519-based scheme on prime-order subgroup)
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Ed25519-Blinded (Ed25519-based scheme from tor)
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XEdDSA-Gimli/Blake2b/Sha3/Sha512 (X25519-based scheme on prime-order Montgomery curve)
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in Signal spec, hash is an unspecified, crypto-secure hashing function
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Sha512 is the default in spec, Gimli is the default in libHydrogen
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Have heard some concern voiced over implementing new proposals, with no backwards compat to current protocols.
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I understand the want to have a router that can talk to routers on those older protocols.
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Service is better on old stuff, until new stuff is widely propagated, old stuff is known to work, etc.
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The main goals of this project are to implement a minimal, secure I2P router library, and promote/develop the new I2P protocols.
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I've even considered splitting off tini2p into separate libraries, each using only one end-to-end crypto and one signing scheme.
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However, I'm only one person, and currently the sole developer on this project.
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ElGamal and DSA are being shelved soon(tm).
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There are also existing router implementations that handle backwards compatibility very well, use those for talking to old stuff.
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Updated Prop. 144
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any questions/comments?
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ok, onto the next
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**tini2p** 3: Short-term goals
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Short-term goals
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With the new end-to-end crypto & blinded signature schemes, it's necessary to take on a crypto library as a full dependency.
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The high-level public APIs are great for standard use, but fall short when implementing new crypto (by design).
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Adding a crypto library as a submodule dependency will grant full control over the internals, and exposing new APIs.
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LibreSSL
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Great support and documentation for X25519 EC arithmetic
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Internal EC functions are low-level enough to implement needed schemes
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Has enough other crypto to be the sole crypto library used in tini2p
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EC arithmetic done on Montgomery curve, no bi-map swapping
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Blake2b and/or Sha3 would be ported from OpenSSL (if needed)
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potential for upstream patches
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patches are unlikely to be included (code bloat)
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libSodium
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Support for X25519 EC arithmetic, but very limited/high-level (as intended)
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X25519 maths are wrappers around ref10 and Ed25519 (faster, secure (as LibreSSL)?)
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X25519 ref10 math is available, but implementing Elligator2 inverse map requires special care
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All EC arithmetic done on Ed25519
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Convert input(s) to Ed25519 point(s), do stuff, convert result to X25519 point
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libHydrogen
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Could act as a replacement for libSodium
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First-class support for X25519 arithmetic (it's the only crypto primitive for signing/encryption)
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Uses Gimli for a generic hashing function
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Would serve as basis for an XEdDSA-Gimli-384 signature proposal
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X25519 maths are low-level enough to be useful for building ECIES-X25519
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Very small code footprint
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All above libraries are unlikely to adopt schemes used in I2P, which means maintaining a local fork dependency for any custom crypto.
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str4d mentioned working on a potential new C crypto library based (at least in part, iirc) on dalek design.
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FWIR, the new library would be low-level enough to implement new schemes, while still providing some protections to the user.
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For the near-to-mid future:
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Experiment w/ adding libHydrogen as a dependency, replacing uses of Blake2b with Gimli
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Implement XEdDSA and ECIES primitives inside (libHydrogen, LibreSSL), and expose simple API
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Write wrappers around libHydrogen API, if it's already low-level enough for XEdDSA + ECIES
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Slightly hesitant to add LibreSSL as a full dependency due to library size.
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LibreSSL is much smaller than OpenSSL, but much larger than libHydrogen.
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If tini2p can make due with LibreSSL/OpenSSL as a system dependency, it will be much better for overall project/binary size.
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That being said, if LibreSSL is a local fork, all unecessary bits can be removed with care (when such concerns become important).
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Usually leave request open for aprox. 1 week, gives a chance for others to review, and to come back to it with fresh eyes for final self-review.
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Outside of crypto concerns, will be working on Tunnels + NetDb, which are largely independent of crypto concerns
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ugh repeating muhself
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any questions/comments?
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**kinghat** im here, i just for the most part dont know what it all means. more of a cheerleader! :P
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**tini2p** heh, feel free to ask questions kinghat
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or, can get you some pom-poms ;)
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4: Meta issues
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Setting up CI on GitLab.
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Working on adding webhooks to the gitter, so those interested can stay updated.
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Setting up IRC bouncer/server
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^ listed in rough order of priority
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CI should be the most simple, just haven't dedicated time to it
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same with the webhooks for this gittter room
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The IRC bouncer requires funds + time, and is fairly low-priority
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costs are purely for hosting
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**kinghat** check out thelounge.chat
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**tini2p** Would like to have a presence on IRC, but other things are taking precedence. Especially since other means of public communication are available.
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will do, thanks @k1nghat
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**kinghat** i also have a VPS host my own thelounge, could probably setup an account if needed.
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**tini2p** sure, but that doesn't really solve the problem
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have had other offers for people to host my IRC bouncer. personally not comfortable with that, though i appreciate the offers
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it really just comes down to paying for a VPS, and setting up a bouncer. simple, but annoying and costs funds
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**kinghat** im in the us. i pay hetzer $2.50 a month for the VPS.
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**tini2p** anyway, focus over the next two weeks will be implementing basic NetDb, updating ECIES implementation, and starting I2NP/Tunnels
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$2.50 a month that i don't need to spend atm
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**kinghat** sure, just letting you know its the cheapest ive found.
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or just host it at home for $free50.
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**tini2p** of course :)
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anyway, spam and other bullshit have made IRC an annoying place to hang out. not in a hurry to rejoin
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i'm on Irc2P, here on gitter, reddit, Wire... how many ways do people need to contact me?
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5: Confirm next meeting time
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Same time, two weeks? So, 2019-04-25 @ 18:00 UTC
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**tini2p** alright, end of meeting, thanks to all for attending
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which means you @k1nghat
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;)
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